[WXBH-Discuss] ISDN, DSL, etc. and 'uploading mp3s'

[John Hicks]

[I posted this reply to the tech list but am now reposting it to the 
general list, since it really concerns some configuration issues that 
would affect programming, etc. My apologies to the tech list for the 
duplicate post. --JRH]

 > at the last meeting
 > it sounded as if everyone just wanted to upload mp3's to the server,
 > which
 > would be ok if we weren't broadcasting live and we had a multiple day
 > buffer
 > time, that would actually allow for us to get dsl and whatnot.

Just to clarify: The scenario Cory is describing is simply one option
that was discussed Tuesday as possibly the ultimate KISS (keep it
simple) approach: to get up and running with the minimum equipment,
real-estate, and overhead. We could expand from there as our budget allowed.

We have definitely not made any decision to go with this. It was merely
presented as a possible stage one configuration in a three-staged
scenario that would ultimately wind up with a centrally located antenna
and studio. (We can discuss this and our other options in more detail at
Saturday's meeting.)

I think the idea occurred to us after I showed Aron the video of
Nashville's operation. They have a PC running a program called ZaraRadio
(http://www.zararadio.com/) which allows you to automate your
programming. You make up playlists of mp3 files and then schedule the
playlists to play at certain times. They use another program (VNC -
virtual network computing) to access this PC (and the others in their
studio) remotely, so they can make up playlists and change the schedule
at will. And they can upload the mp3s via FTP. Plus they indicated they
can actually call in and get on the air live remotely if they need to.

Nashville has a good deal of live programming, including call-in
programs, so this automated approach is used for off-hours. (They
broadcast 24/7.)

There are disadvantages to this automated approach: It might be too easy
to fall into the trap of being completely automated and failing to
provide valuable live programming. And the absence of a central studio
might discourage the development of a sense of community among the
volunteer producers and engineers, etc.

On the other hand, this approach might allow us to proceed to a stage
two that includes a network of distributed studios (in schools,
community centers, home offices, etc.) so that it would be easier for
diverse groups to originate programming.

And the immediate advantage is cost: The present Brick House has a
monthly budget of $1400, Flashcube building is asking $1200 to $1500 a
month, and then there is the ISDN or DSL link, etc. Before you know it,
to paraphrase Sen. Dirksen, we could be talking about real money. And at
this point we have $0 in ongoing income!

We've got several plates spinning right now and it might seem like we're
just complicating things by considering too many options at this time.
But the fact is that we can't make any final decisions on configuration
until we get some other matters settled regarding governance, finances,
fund-raising, and a construction budget. These will probably be settled
within a few weeks. Until then, we can be discussing all our options and
perhaps even experimenting with some of the (free, open source) computer
software, production setups, and even streaming, etc.

(Well, this started out as a quick clarification and I got a little
carried away, as usual. Sorry)

--John

Cory R wrote:
 > Paul,
 >
 > This discussion needs to be made in the Technical mailing list.
 >
 > It's a big mess any way you look at it.  ISDN is slow, at the last 
meeting
 > it sounded as if everyone just wanted to upload mp3's to the server, 
which
 > would be ok if we weren't broadcasting live and we had a multiple day
 > buffer
 > time, that would actually allow for us to get dsl and whatnot.  Iglou is
 > running a deal for 1.5mb/256kb at $29.95/mo, which would be quite nice.
 > Since the antenna location wouldn't need any significant upload.
 >
 > By speed on the 802.11 link I was referring to overall bandwidth and
 > latency
 > times.  I'm really unsure how fast microwave is now but last I checked
 > (probably 6+ years ago) it was sitting around 5mbps.  The idea location
 > would be at the Brick House or near a surrounding building.  So we would
 > skip the internet completely.  Although I'll start looking for ISDN 
modems
 > and looking at software for that.  Seeing that we're wanting to do 
internet
 > radio (I'll actually be setting up an icecast server sometime today) 
also,
 > it will probably be just as easy to pull that stream down from the web at
 > the antenna location rather than streaming it over the ISDN.
 >
 > As far as encoding audio, I would either recommend mp3, or ogg vorbis (
 > http://www.vorbis.com/) formats rather than mp4.  Licensing issues 
aside I
 > think for practical reasons it would be alot better to just stick 
with mp3
 > and/or ogg.  Something interesting I found on the net was
 > http://www.xciv.org/~meta/audio-shootout/.   I don't see a need to 
use the
 > mp4 format on what we're doing anyway since it may require licensing and
 > since radio isn't exactly the highest quality of sound anyway.  I'd say
 > stick to mp3 or ogg vorbis.
 >
 > Cory
 >
 >
 > On 5/31/06, topdog at woofer.com <topdog at woofer.com> wrote:
 >>
 >> Hi Cory,
 >>
 >> ISDN is an Integrated Subscriber Digital Network.  It could be used to
 >> get
 >> to
 >> the internet - but it is actually a digital line provided by the
 >> telephone
 >> company.  As I understand it, it is not a "dedicated" line (you still
 >> have
 >> to
 >> dial a phone number (or SPID) but once a connection is 3established, it
 >> will be
 >> linked at that speed indefinitely.
 >>
 >> The 802.11 link would not be any faster than microwave.  Both are moving
 >> at the
 >> speed of light.  The main advantage is that the equipment would be much
 >> cheaper
 >> (and safer) than microwaves.  We could build our own antennas for that
 >> part of
 >> it too.  Some people have modified Pringles cans.  But that link is only
 >> going
 >> to work Line of Sight - and you can't try to stop anyone who is building
 >> something in your way.  I think that the Kentucky Towers across the
 >> street
 >> is
 >> the only feasible way to do line of sight communications.  It is 
possible
 >> that
 >> Ky Towers might have a view of the "flashcube" building but not likely
 >> given
 >> their distance apart and heights.  Even if they did, we would have 
to get
 >> permission from the Tower to use it as a "hop" point. No sense in
 >> paying 2
 >> places for rent.
 >>
 >> I still think that ISDN would be our best (and cheapest) bet for now. If
 >> you
 >> can, use your talents to find some ISDN modems and a codec
 >> algorithm.  ISDN is
 >> very slow next to DSL so a high compression algorithm is need to 
code and
 >> decode.  I hear that MP4 is quite nice but I don't know if it needs 
to be
 >> commecially licensed for use...  If you could find out, that would be
 >> great.
 >>
 >> Paul
 >>
 >>